tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8746692.post2162208405911320874..comments2024-03-29T02:03:49.151-04:00Comments on History Unfolding: The end of our Islamic adventureDavid Kaiserhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05020082243968071584noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8746692.post-44542611141650322972012-03-02T23:51:14.787-05:002012-03-02T23:51:14.787-05:00Professor
Many thanks for this post.
I would jus...Professor<br /><br />Many thanks for this post.<br /><br />I would just mention that the time has long past,<br /> <br />rather than has now come, <br /><br />for a frank reappraisal of our foreign policy in the Cold War.<br /><br />Too bad really, <br /><br />but could it have been any other way, <br /><br />given the political and ideological antecedents?<br /><br />As I have said on my blog, it is now game over, rather than time for a frank reappraisal.<br /><br />All the best,<br />GMBozonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18078858723231122013noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8746692.post-20361989228029919302012-02-28T19:02:26.867-05:002012-02-28T19:02:26.867-05:00Actually I was associated with the JFK school but ...Actually I was associated with the JFK school but that was LONG time ago. It does turn out interventionists nowadays.<br /><br /> I apologize for accidentally, apparently, deleting a comment. Feel free to repost.David Kaiserhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05020082243968071584noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8746692.post-69391210891137603752012-02-27T22:20:32.812-05:002012-02-27T22:20:32.812-05:00Shelterdog said...
"t is in our interest--an...Shelterdog said...<br /><br />"t is in our interest--and the interest of the world's stability--that the forces of modernism, pluralism and democracy flourish."<br /><br />How many idiotic crusades have we launched in the last century using **exactly** that rationale?!?!? I don't wish to be harsh, but I swear you remind me of Woody Wilson, clucking about the nefarious Kaiser and his Huns.<br /><br />If our adventures in Vietnam and Iraq and Afghanistan and Panama and Nicaragua and Iran and... you get the idea... have shown us anything, it's that WE ARE NOT COMPETENT to shepard **anybody** onto the blessed path of tolerance and eight hours a day in the cubicle farm. We need to let other societies sort out their own problems. They're going to anyway. In the meantime, commerce and cultural exchange are going to be far more mutually beneficial -- hence "influential" -- than any grand strategy dreamed up by assholes in the Beltway or the Kennedy School of Sinecures, er, Government, I mean*.<br /><br />I really think that we're still dogged by the Second World War, except that the lessons we drew are almost the opposite of those drawn by the nations that actually hosted the thing. We actually **did** manage to put together some very admirable and effective statecraft during and immediately after that conflict. But our problem ever since has been that we can't seem to grasp what a truly rare circumstance that was. -- sglover<br /><br />* Hope that last doesn't step on your toes, Dr. Kaiser. You've never been associated with that "school", correct? As far as I can tell the Kennedy School is where Beltway tapeworms go to hibernate when their tribe is out of power, or when they've reached the end of their "careers". I don't believe you're among that lot at all.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8746692.post-16078070746330892712012-02-27T21:45:10.833-05:002012-02-27T21:45:10.833-05:00I believe that Bacevich has also sketched the real...I believe that Bacevich has also sketched the real reason that Obama "endorsed" our Afghan adventure: Although it's been totally aimless in any strategic sense, it was always more justifiable than the Iraq invasion (i.e., it wasn't based completely on lies). Also, Afghanistan is a backwater, far from oil sources, far from Israel, far from anything that might stir American domestic opinion.<br /><br />What better theater, then, for a politician determined to "look tough"? Dems are instinctively afraid of appearing "soft". "Commanding" an army in the field -- however pointlessly -- is a wonderful, cost-free way of innoculating Obama from that. If I remember correctly, Bacevich emphasized this in an essay a while back. Bush was an idiot, sure, but he probably did have some kind of bonehead sincerity about his wars. For Obama, Afghanistan is all about domestic political tactics, nothing more.<br /><br />Since the Republicans have evolved into some kind of mental ward roadshow, it seems likely that Obama will win again. (**Why** he wants to escapes me. He's already assured of the Davos jet set life. He's never seemed to have any clear idea of what he wants to **do** in the White House, other than add it to the resume'. So what's the point?) But after all the stay-at-home voters have cast their "abstain" ballots (my own plan), I'll bet that his "mandate" includes maybe, generously, 20% of the adult population. This is how systems lose legitimacy.<br />-- sgloverAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8746692.post-9407114183224528282012-02-27T15:04:37.061-05:002012-02-27T15:04:37.061-05:00If ending our "Islamic adventure" refers...If ending our "Islamic adventure" refers to the use of military force, I agree. However, we shouldn't overlook the fact that there is currently a struggle in many countries of the Middle East between those who support modernism, pluralism and democracy, and those who oppose those objectives. It is in our interest--and the interest of the world's stability--that the forces of modernism, pluralism and democracy flourish. As I see it, the question isn't simply whether we send the troops everywhere or withdraw altogether, but whether the US can take other actions, short of military power, to promote its ideals and to support those who seek to adapt similar ideals to their own societies.Shelterdoghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09973906960864702661noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8746692.post-57712077359130374992012-02-26T10:15:20.530-05:002012-02-26T10:15:20.530-05:00The fourth paragraph makes an important point, abo...The fourth paragraph makes an important point, about the "postmodern" nature of how the U.S. elites now exercise power. The U.S. intervened in the U.S. massively in the last decade, for reasons that even now that remain unclear because all the public justifications have been pretty obvious lies. <br /><br />The U.S. now seems to be withdrawing from the Middle East, but to what extent is unclear, because now no justifications for the new policy are being advanced at all. And the lies used to advance the previous policy have not been investigated or repudiated. So you get the strange phenomena of a public campaign starting to attack Iran at the same time the U.S. military is withdrawing from the region.Ednoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8746692.post-70329147602121169692012-02-26T08:23:56.156-05:002012-02-26T08:23:56.156-05:00Excellent analysis! Regrettably, many of us who sh...Excellent analysis! Regrettably, many of us who should have have known better were shocked and traumatized into blind support of Bush's military initiatives into Afghanistan and Iraq.<br />If we had just proceeded to get Bin Laden in Afghanistan in late 2001 instead of waiting for the Northern War Lords to join us, under the fantasy notion that it would "build concensus for regime change" -- i.e., wipe out the Taliban, we could have gone in and gotten out in 6 months, having killed or captured Bin Laden.<br />Then, the bizarre idea that Saddam harbored "WMD's" in Iraq that threatened us would have been seen more clearly as Bush's irrational megalomania. <br />That Obama hasn't acted more courageously to get us out, and hasn't adequately punished the "banksters" and their GOP supporters for crashing the economy, means that his only hope for a 2nd term is the wackiness of the current GOP field.Bob in NCnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8746692.post-14242030639923667612012-02-26T07:57:58.541-05:002012-02-26T07:57:58.541-05:00Sic transit Imperium Americana.Sic transit Imperium Americana.Pat Mathewsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8746692.post-36781231262043050642012-02-26T05:26:44.031-05:002012-02-26T05:26:44.031-05:00The rationalist says don't help Syria. This is...The rationalist says don't help Syria. This is Realpolitik. The Russians and Chinese are applying it now as for the Russians Assad is their friendly dictator like USA had Pinochet, for example. <br /><br />Since the pictures are coming out daily from the war zone due to modern technology of photo telephones and internet the story cannot be ignored so the outrage in Sunni countries like Saudi Arabia, a very important US ally in the region due to its massive oil reserves, is large and growing. So pressure keeps growing. Al Quaeda is already there doing large bombings. Weapons supplies and CIA agents are highly likely involved. Chavez is sending Diesel to Assad. The Russians and Iranians park their warships at the Syrian Naval base. I suppose it will be like in Iran, SWIFT transfers, all trade, etc. will be stopped as ships refuse to go to Iran (no insurance coverage). So the people if they are not self sufficient in food will start to starve. This is a tripwire between West and Russia and Shia and Sunni countries like Sarajevo in WWI perhaps. We can't stay out as we are already too deep in and we can't openly go in without violating the UN charter (so why are they saying they will attack Iran without a UN mandate?). The increasing tension and uncertainty will just blow the oil price sky high as we have seen recently causing a renewed recession and real reason for war as this could cause major bankruptcies of countries, US states, Chinese provinces. So one thing leads to another because like in 1914 everything is too interconnected. WWII was on purpose and WWI an accident. Let's hope the Middle East problems don't get to be a really big accident causing WWIII.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com